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Title: Brown sets out reform proposals - Trust in politics?

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Messages: 1528
Registration date: 13/10/2006
Added: 03/07/2007 20:16
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/6258794.stm

Who is Gordon Brown fooling? We all know he is the 'problem' - not the 'solution'. He IS the reason there is little trust in politics and politicians.

Quote:
KEY PROPOSALS
Give MPs power to decide whether to wage war
Setting up national security council
Parliament to ratify international treaties
Commons committees for each English region
New ministerial code
PM no longer to choose Church of England bishops
Elections moving from Thursday to weekends
MPs to hold hearings on key public appointments
People to be consulted on possible 'bill of rights'
Potential lowering of voting age to 16


I can see Gordon pursing his lips right now as he sets out these 'new' proposals. No, it won't work.

Gordon Brown, I do NOT trust you .

Last edited by: canvas on 05/07/2007 19:52
Vespasian

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Messages: 318
Registration date: 09/03/2007
Added: 03/07/2007 20:30
Hear hear - and what makes it worse is that the Sun and the rest of the media will lap it up.

This joker has been at the heart of every policy this Government has made for the past 10 years the sooner he's booted out on his arse the better.

I think all he's doing is setting up a system that abrogates responsibility for descision making on to the shoulders of others so that he can give the gallic shrug and say "not my problem you'll have to talk to....". This is cleverly disguised stuff much the same as the Interest Rate Committeee at the B of E taking responsibility for any bad news on the economic front while he can take all the glory if it goes right.

Lizabeth

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Messages: 556
Registration date: 12/10/2006
Added: 03/07/2007 20:33
Canvas
Perhaps we should add some involving truth,transparency and accountability. Those have been conveniently sidelined particularly in the lead up to the publication of the recent UK Protocol for wind (Foreward by Lord Truscott Parliamentary Undersecretary of State for Energy)

Agamemnon

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Messages: 56
Registration date: 23/06/2007
Added: 03/07/2007 20:54
Does Gordon really think that a country can be led by committee?
"Oh my god the Russians have attacked"
..."Wait while I check if we've ratified the minutes from the last meeting and have enough biscuits in the tin....you can't have a meeting without biscuits"...

Giving Parliament the Royal Perogative (to declare war) is a nonsense. How on earth is a future Prime Minister supposed to defend the country if he has a hung Parliament?

And giving 16 year olds the vote? I guess we'll be alright then, its not like 16 year olds don't have experience of voting, look at X-Factor (not that I ever watch it), they never get it wrong do they....I can only imagine the mess that this would create. As an ulterior motive for this move don't younger people tend to be more left wing, and more radical, before reality and logic overrides emotion; hence building in a future Labour cadre of voters.

Moving elections to the weekend sounds reasonable, but in my mind the reason that turnout is so low in recent elections is that (a) parties are all so similar as they are all fighting for the same mediocre patch of 'centre' ground; (b) candidates are so similar, with career politicians holding office in some cases for upwards of 12 years (can anyone stay in touch with reality after 12 years in the insulated corridors of the Westminster village); (c) a feeling that politics doesn't change anything.

A bill of rights is a good idea, but you have to balance rights with responsibilities. All too often in this society people demand their 'rights', 'I know my rights', 'I'm entitled'; nobody ever asks what their responsibilities are. If a Bill of Rights is to be discussed it should be a totally non-partisan debate with all MPs given a free vote as it would be fundamental to British law.

I forsee a mess of committees taking decisions on virtually every aspect of British life, and yes that is in effect what Parliament is for, but why even bother having a Prime Minister if we're going to reduce his/her ability to lead? Lets just have a giant committee to rule the country, no hang on a minute where have I heard that before...Russia 1917-1990, communist China?

yorker

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Messages: 1809
Registration date: 26/03/2007
Added: 03/07/2007 21:01
There was more than enough time for tea and bickies on the last occasion.....

I agree giving 16 year-olds the vote is mad. No-one should get the vote until they become taxpayers.

And if we need to keep talking about being British, or have it written down for us, we're obviously not Brits.

Oh yes, and CofE bishops in future must pass a political awareness exam before venturing into parliament.

Last edited by: yorker on 03/07/2007 21:04
Votedave

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Messages: 543
Registration date: 30/09/2006
Added: 03/07/2007 21:17
Yes, Vespasian. The media are hugging Gordon Brown to their breast at the moment. Ugh!
I agree with just about everything Agamemnon says.

I could have sworn David Cameron proposed a new bill of rights over a year ago... These are NOT Gordon Brown's ideas, DO YOU HEAR ME RUPERT MURDOCH??!

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Messages: 1528
Registration date: 13/10/2006
Added: 03/07/2007 21:59
Votedave - relax. There really is some truth in the saying "A week is a LONG time in politics".

We know a phoney when we see one - peek a boo Gordon!

Votedave

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Messages: 543
Registration date: 30/09/2006
Added: 03/07/2007 22:09
Thanks canvas - I'm as cool as a cucumber now, as usual :)

Agamemnon

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Messages: 56
Registration date: 23/06/2007
Added: 03/07/2007 22:11
I know its only been a week in the Fifedom of Gordon but I have honestly hated every minute of it.

How can a dedicated centraliser like Brown honestly be talking of decentralising [executive power]?

He's getting a free ride from the Murdoch press. Unfortunately until the Murdoch media monopoly is broken I think we might have to strap on the tin hats and hide under the kitchen table. How can one man have quite so much power and influence?

Just thought of a new format for elections under Brown to help the 16 year olds (sorry to any 16 year olds who might be reading this, feel free to disagree): politician idol. We start wih 600+ MPs then every Friday there will be an 'Elec-viction' and a we eliminate 1 more and eventually we end up with a new Prime Minister! Get Galloway out 1st!

Last edited by: Agamemnon on 03/07/2007 22:19
timbill

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Messages: 286
Registration date: 01/03/2007
Added: 03/07/2007 22:25
Quote:
Elections moving from Thursday to weekends


Only a public sector worker would think most people work 9-5 Monday-Friday.

DaveGould

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Messages: 443
Registration date: 04/12/2006
Added: 03/07/2007 22:35
Agamemnon wrote:
Quote:
How on earth is a future Prime Minister supposed to defend the country if he has a hung Parliament?


How many MPs would vote to not defend the country?

Quote:
All too often in this society people demand their 'rights', 'I know my rights'


Generally, they don't. They often confuse moral rights (aka wishful thinking) with legal rights that a court will intervene over.

Quote:
but why even bother having a Prime Minister if we're going to reduce his/her ability to lead?


Because Prime Minister doesn't mean President.

Vespasian

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Messages: 318
Registration date: 09/03/2007
Added: 04/07/2007 09:12
Quote:
I guess we'll be alright then, its not like 16 year olds don't have experience of voting, look at X-Factor

We will have to allow text message voting though otherwise they'll be buggered!!

canvas

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Messages: 1528
Registration date: 13/10/2006
Added: 04/07/2007 16:54
Why is Gordon Brown so boring?
He puts people into comas when he speaks!

Amberlina

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Messages: 58
Registration date: 28/06/2007
Added: 04/07/2007 19:17
I'd rather have substance instead of a fantastically good speaker. Now if he delivers well I'll forget his monotonous voice in front of the cameras.

Lizabeth

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Messages: 556
Registration date: 12/10/2006
Added: 05/07/2007 14:49
From Webcameron’s man(?) in the North East. An update

A full time MP “working in Sedgefield for Sedgefield “

That is the promise of Phil Wilson The Labour candidate for the Sedgefield by –election
Andrew Spence is the BNP candidate. He was the farmer instrumental in the fuel protests (2000) that brought the country to a standstill
.Graham Robb is a local businessman He intends to campaign against the unelected regional assembly . *


* Imagine a gigantic smiling /dancing emotican

canvas

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Messages: 1528
Registration date: 13/10/2006
Added: 06/07/2007 11:01
Quote:
Just as Brown is considered a control freak, Cameron is seen to be "policy-lite". In fact, it is Cameron's biggest PR failure that he has allowed this perception to fester: there is actually a raft of policies that Cameron himself has announced.

These policies include the setting up of a pensions lifeboat fund, a 3p reduction in business taxes, the abolition of stamp duty on shares, no more closures of special schools, a Bill on NHS independence, abolishing many NHS targets, reducing carbon emissions, the abolition of ID cards, the introduction of border police, a Bill of Rights, scrapping the council tax revaluation, a referendum on the new EU treaty… you get the picture.


Read this blog by Iain Dale - click here

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