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Title: English Only Vs English Plus

Iftikhar

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Messages: 7
Registration date: 17/05/2007
Added: 02/07/2007 17:23
English Only Vs English Plus
There is an increase of those children in state schools who do not come from English speaking back ground. One in seven children at primary school in England and one in ten at secondary school speak a language other than English at home. A research team from Goldsmiths concludes that using two or more languages deepens an understanding of mathematical concepts and results in a better overall performance in school. Bilingual children are able to access key concepts through both languages, giving them an advantage over monolinguals. Children who speak at least two languages actually strengthen their identities as learners and boost their cognitive development. Researchers say this finding is of particular importance for second and third generation immigrant children. It is important to “embed” mother tongues into daily activities through games, songs and incidental use, such as answering the register and giving praise and simple instructions, familiar stories can be told or acted out in their languages.

In the 60s and 70s, the British education system has destroyed the home languages and the new research proved that the policy was wrong and the British education system is guilty of crime against humanity. It is very important that immigrant parents keep talking to their children in their home tongues as this will give children a valuable tool to access lessons, deepen understanding of key ideas, and enhance overall school performance. Children who led bilingual lives could access their lessons through both languages. The children in the project expressed a strong desire to use their community languages in school. Teachers were able to tap into their pupils’ full range of cultural knowledge.

Children who attended mother tongues classes did better in their National Curriculum tests. Research suggests that bilingual pupils do better than those with just one language. The researcher warns that many second and third generation children are in danger of losing their bilingual skills if they do not have the chance to develop their mother tongue through their school work. Multilingual children may be allowed to use their mother tongue in mainstream classes. Rather than thinking in terms of an “English only” culture we should be promoting “English plus”.

Among all the migrant children, Muslim children suffer more than others. Bilingual Muslim children need state funded Muslim schools with bilingual Muslim teachers as role models. They need to be well versed in Standard English to follow the National Curriculum and go for higher studies and research to serve humanity. They need to be well versed in Arabic, Urdu and other community languages to keep in touch with their cultural roots and enjoy the beauty of their literature and poetry.
Iftikhar Ahmad
www.londonschoolofislamics.org.uk

canvas

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Messages: 1528
Registration date: 13/10/2006
Added: 02/07/2007 17:25
Maybe Latin should make a come-back - since understanding Latin makes it easier to learn new languages?

Graham

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Messages: 767
Registration date: 28/12/2006
Added: 02/07/2007 18:58
Canvas:

Quote:
Maybe Latin should make a come-back - since understanding Latin makes it easier to learn new languages?


And in reply I give you "People called 'Romanes', they go the house"? ;-)

I "learned" Latin for two years at school from 11 to 12 and I was damned glad that I didn't have to waste any more time on it after that. We had the opportunity to keep Latin or switch to German or Russian, so I picked German as at least having some possible use to me.

Latin only has value if you're interested in being a classical scholar, otherwise there's little point to it.

timbill

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Messages: 286
Registration date: 01/03/2007
Added: 02/07/2007 19:51
Graham,

Latin per se may be useless, but it provided me with a greater understanding of the structure and derivation of language and did indeed make understanding and learning other languages much easier.
I remember one French teacher complaining bitterly that she didn't have a hope to teach us French Grammar as we hadn't learned English yet.

Amberlina

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Messages: 58
Registration date: 28/06/2007
Added: 02/07/2007 20:00
It might be true but I defy them to say anybody in my year at school has a better grasp of the English language than myself. I average between 95%-100% and learning a second language might have strengthened it but I think if you read enough, practise enough, you'll do just fine in everything. Hard work, ambition and application will pay off.

providor

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Messages: 224
Registration date: 29/10/2006
Added: 02/07/2007 20:16
Whilst I would not presume to argue with the main point of this post, the bit that bothers me is

Quote:
Bilingual Muslim children need state funded Muslim schools with bilingual Muslim teachers as role models.

I disagree strongly with this. State funded schools should not be promoting any particular religion - religious indoctrination of children is wrong and the state should not even be condoning it, let alone be involved in it. By all means teach them about religions from a historical, anthropological and sociological standpoint but do not try to impose the faith of their parents and/or their communities on them. Let them choose their own faith (or no faith) when they are older and have the intellectual maturity to see religion for what it is.

Donnie

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Messages: 308
Registration date: 01/10/2006
Added: 02/07/2007 20:24
Like provider this sentance also worrys me

Quote:
Bilingual Muslim children need state funded Muslim schools with bilingual Muslim teachers as role models.


We dont separate children on the colour of their skin or race so why is there a need to separate them on their religion, and why do they only need Muslim teachers as role models.

How are communties going to interact with one another if they are always being separated. Havnt we had enough of this in northern ireland and seen the results there.

Sorry no I dont agree with this.

timbill

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Messages: 286
Registration date: 01/03/2007
Added: 02/07/2007 20:59
Providor and Donnie,

I attended two religious schools, of two different denominations of Christianity.

I can't say that I felt indoctrinated and have chosen my own life since. But I agree with you that the tone in the post above when calling for muslim schools at least sounds like a call for segregation and maintenance of the culture of the homeland to the exclusion of acceptance of and integration into the local culture.
I agree that we should all have an understanding of the culture of our roots and this can only be achieved with an understanding of the language. Children of Arabic backgrounds should learn Arabic, Urdu etc but perhaps this is best done in the home or at the mosque?

Last edited by: timbill on 02/07/2007 21:19
timbill

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Messages: 286
Registration date: 01/03/2007
Added: 02/07/2007 21:02
Amberlina, I too achieved those kinds of percentages in English at school but it wan't necessary to have a firm grounding in grammar to achieve them. We simply didn't learn the structure of our language in a formal way and I can't see that has changed since I left school.

Donnie

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Messages: 308
Registration date: 01/10/2006
Added: 02/07/2007 21:12
Timbill, I can see where you are coming from but to be honest with you this roots business gets on my nerves. Take my family for instance, one set of grandparents from Ireland, My husbands family grandparents from Scotland - but we were both born and raised in England and as far as we are concerned we are English. Im not putting this very well but I think a lot of children with immigrant parents must be very confused these days not knowing which culture they should belong to, being taught one thing at home, and another at school - it puts them between a rock and a hard place with torn loyalties.

providor

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Messages: 224
Registration date: 29/10/2006
Added: 02/07/2007 21:14
Quote:
Children of Arabic backgrounds should learn Arabic

Why? There's nothing intrinsically wrong with children of Arabic backgrounds (or any other children for that matter) learning Arabic or any other languge, but why do you say that children of Arabic backgrounds should learn Arabic?

timbill

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Messages: 286
Registration date: 01/03/2007
Added: 02/07/2007 21:15
Donnie: Quite possibly. But perhaps they should have the tools to choose?

Providor: Because language influences thought processes as much as environmental factors and they will understand their families and themselves better if they understand their language.

Last edited by: timbill on 02/07/2007 21:18
providor

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Messages: 224
Registration date: 29/10/2006
Added: 02/07/2007 21:33
Quote:
Because language influences thought processes as much as environmental factors and they will understand their families and themselves better if they understand their language.

But shouldn't that be a matter of choice, not compulsion? Could one not use the same arguement to say that we should all learn Arabic so that we reach a better understanding of our ethnically Arabic compatriots?

timbill

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Messages: 286
Registration date: 01/03/2007
Added: 02/07/2007 22:05
Providor, I think that might be stretching what I said a little far.

The problem with not teaching the language early on, is that in itself removes the choice. It's far harder to learn a language later in life.

Iftikhar

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Messages: 7
Registration date: 17/05/2007
Added: 05/07/2007 21:16
Salaam

Muslim Children have been suffering academically, linguistically, socially, emotionally and spiritually for the last 50 odd years because they have been in a wrong place at a wrong time. The state schools are exam factories producing children with A to C Grades. They do not educate children, as a result, institutional racism, drug, crime, incivility, ant-social behaviour, binge drinking, high rate of abortions and teen age pregnancies are common part of life in state schools. Muslim parents do not want their children to be integrated into such barbarity.

Majority of Muslim children leave schools with low grades because state schools with monolingual teachers are not capable to teach Standard English to bilingual children.

Bilingual Muslim children need state funded Muslim schools with bilingual Muslim teachers as role models. They need to be well versed in Standard English to follow the National Curriculum and go for higher studies and research to serve humanity. They need to be well versed in Arabic, Urdu and other community languages to keep in touch with their cultural roots and enjoy the beauty of their literature and poetry.

A Muslim is a citizen of this tiny global village. He/She does not want to become notoriously monolingual Brits.

canvas

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Messages: 1528
Registration date: 13/10/2006
Added: 05/07/2007 21:34
Quote:
Bilingual Muslim children need state funded Muslim schools with bilingual Muslim teachers as role models


The state should not fund any religious schools.

timbill

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Messages: 286
Registration date: 01/03/2007
Added: 05/07/2007 21:39
Iftikhar
Repeating yourself is not the same as debating.

My next comment is in no way rascist, anti-Muslim or anti-multiculterism but:

Quote:
Muslim parents do not want their children to be integrated into such barbarity........A Muslim is a citizen of this tiny global village. He/She does not want to become notoriously monolingual Brits


Then choose somewhere else to live if you do not want to be British.

providor

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Messages: 224
Registration date: 29/10/2006
Added: 05/07/2007 22:04
Quote:
The state schools are exam factories producing children with A to C Grades. They do not educate children, as a result, institutional racism, drug, crime, incivility, ant-social behaviour, binge drinking, high rate of abortions and teen age pregnancies are common part of life in state schools. Muslim parents do not want their children to be integrated into such barbarity.

And you think that all non-muslim parents do? Plenty of us would dearly like to see these unpleasant and damaging behaviours eliminated from our schools and our society, and maybe we can learn something from Islam. If you want to improve things for all of us, integrate and change society for the better from within. If you separate yourselves into Muslim enclaves how is that going to help anybody?

Graham

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Messages: 767
Registration date: 28/12/2006
Added: 06/07/2007 12:08
iftikhar:

Quote:
Bilingual Muslim children need state funded Muslim schools with bilingual Muslim teachers as role models. They need to be well versed in Standard English to follow the National Curriculum and go for higher studies and research to serve humanity. They need to be well versed in Arabic, Urdu and other community languages to keep in touch with their cultural roots and enjoy the beauty of their literature and poetry.


I agree that Muslim children should have the opportunity to learn about the culture and language of their parents and grandparents, but I cannot agree that this should be state funded. It should be up to their parents/ community to sort this out.

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