Posted by kozmicstu on Friday, 16 February 2007 11:02:11

This is true. Unfortunately it's the one element of the equation which cannot be controlled by the government. The fact that so many fathers don't feel they need or want to be a part of their child's upbringing, in my opinion, is the inevitable product of the 'independent' lifestyle glorified in magazines, movies and popular culture. People shouldn't be independent, they should be interdependent. Unfortunately, it's not so glamourous to actually want to have a family and so on as it is to be 'free'.

People just don't know what's good for them...

Now that's said, I think it's really important to mention the many many fathers who DO wish to have an active part in their child's future, but because of various issues with the legal system or their former partners, they are unable to or are forced away.

Posted by coolcatmillie on Friday, 16 February 2007 11:19:31

I agree we have heard a couple of time now, DC view on the importance of a father’s influence and the need to be in a childs life.
But I am yet to hear him say how he intends to put the situation right with regards to those who are desperately trying to fight a battle for access that is almost impossible to win under the current system.
However I’m not a supporter of the idea that children are likely to go of the rails if Dad is not around. I think what we are witnessing in today society is far more complicated.
It’s about youngster feeling they have no voice, lack of education, no work, lack of punishment etc
And I do wonder how many of the younger generation who are committing such crimes, are actually children of parents that had their son/daughter at a young age, and also felt maybe excluded form society at the time.

 

Comment edited by coolcatmillie on Friday, 16 February 2007 11:26:06

Posted by davetheslave on Friday, 16 February 2007 11:37:55

Coolcatmillie

It's funny that you should state that a lack of punishment is responsible for the plight of children in Britain today. Britain is one of the most punitative societies for children in the western world, and many commentators are attributing this as a contributing factor in our poor showing in the recent UN table. The countries which came highest, Netherlands and Sweden, have a much more laissez-faire attitute to children's behaviour. See for instance this comment piece in the Guardian (CiF):
http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/steven_stol/2007/02/why_is_it_so_nice_to_grow_up_i.html

Posted by coolcatmillie on Friday, 16 February 2007 11:52:37

davetheslave.
What is your fascination... waiting until certain members post a blog, for you.... it really is an unhealthy habit you have.
But since you’ve taken the time to track my post down again, to see if there is a flaw I will take the time an answer it.
Lack of punishment was one of the factors that could be a contribution to the increase of crime we are witnessing on our street.
When a crime happens you often find that this is never their 1st, 2nd, 3rd or 4th time they have had a brush with the law, and have gone unpunished, this will give anyone the superior belief that they are above the law and can do as they please.
As I said it was ONE of the reasons I feel there is an increase.

Posted by davetheslave on Friday, 16 February 2007 12:23:42

Coolcatmillie

If you consider it an unhealthy habit to reply to posts that I don't agree with, then yes, I'm a sick, sick man. If you feel in any way singled out for special attention, then you're wrong, it's simply that I tend to disagree with you on just about every point of any significance, and I tend to ignore the 911/cannabis threads.

With regards to children getting away with everything...I disagree (surprise, surprise!). I assume that there are no reliable stats on how many crimes by children go unpunished, so we'll just have to agree to disagree. However, the fact that we've introduced ASBOs for everything that isn't punishable by regular law, does in my opinion give weight to my argument.

Posted by coolcatmillie on Friday, 16 February 2007 13:28:32

davetheslave
I take on board your comments however; I don’t think I have actually suggested that I believe that children getting away with everything, but there are many communities where seriuos crime is being rewarded rather than punished.
I don’t believe that it is an intentional; I believe is that Britain is at a loss on how to handle it.
Last year in a “rough area” where there are many anti-social problems with children as well as Adults, on Bonfire night children from this area went on the rampage burning empty houses and resident’s cars,putting lives in danger.
The same children responsible have also taken part is “vandalism” previous to this and were often spoken to by officers.
But what happened was a “police jolly” for these unruly youngsters.

http://www.thisissouthwales.co.uk/displayNode.jsp?nodeId=161389&command;=displayContent&sourceNode;=161372&contentPK;=15879096&moduleName;=InternalSearch&formname;=filtersearch

Actions like this a confusing for children, they are not being taught right form wrong, and rather there may rewards if you take pat in anti-socail/crime etc.
David Cameron suggest that communities also have a responsibility to the young, which is fair,however we have a community 1st project that encourages working together and social responsiblility but unfortuanly there is still a divide as those who don’t have problems with their children and ASBOS dont not want their child mixing with the “naughty” children.
So what do we do?

Posted by canvas on Friday, 16 February 2007 14:02:01

I love 'naughty' children. They are usually the most interesting ones. (What did I read yesterday that made me laugh? - " I love children - I just couldn't eat a whole one". ONLY JOKING!)

I tend to find that if you pay a little attention to a 'naughty' child you can learn so much from them. Sometimes it's just a cry for help - they want love and attention. They are usually misunderstood and they feel marginilised. If we paid more attention to our 'naughty' children and showed them a little love then we would have some surprising results! :)

Posted by coolcatmillie on Friday, 16 February 2007 14:12:09

Yes canvas you can learn so much form some of them...how to hot wire a car, pick a garage lock...
But you are an adult and not a child some parents feel that the "naughty" children will lead their children astray.
It’s much easier for a child to feel pressure to fit in with them, and it a fear for parents.
But the point I was making was that within the community centre and its activities there are always the same children, from the same lifestyle and background.

If we paid more attention to our 'naughty' children and showed them a little love then we would have some surprising results,
this is what communities 1st trys to achive,but as I told you before its not actually working.

 

Comment edited by coolcatmillie on Friday, 16 February 2007 14:15:25

Posted by canvas on Friday, 16 February 2007 14:19:53

What should we do then? Send all the 'naughty' children to that great big 'naughty step' in the sky? :)

No, we should pay a little attention to them and see how we can help them. You get what you give...you give what you get.

That's why I think 'mentor' programmes are so important. It's amazing what results you can get with a little show of affection and interest.

http://www.hsmp.org.uk/index.asp

Posted by coolcatmillie on Friday, 16 February 2007 14:30:38

No canvas I don’t know the answer if I did when I was a did work with the youth I wouldn’t have felt I was banging my head against a wall on times.
There needs to be, with regards to children, interactivity from all walks of life, or those who are on ASBOs will always think they are different and some feel they are special, along with the feeling that none wants to be their friend. Some of these children would love to break away from their current circle of friends but feel that they don’t get given a chance, because the children they would love to be will not (because of parents fears) spend time with them on community projects.

Posted by canvas on Friday, 16 February 2007 14:33:46

That's why it is so important to give these children an 'escape route' . Positive attracts positive. Success breeds success.
Perhaps it's a cliche - but it's oh so true.

Posted by coolcatmillie on Friday, 16 February 2007 14:41:01

But maybe the biggest issue is in the home,
Where
Behaviour breeds behaviour!
And what ever you do out side in society working with the youth, they still go back home where authority and respect is shunned

Anyway we are going of topic slightly...this bog was about missing fathers,and it is an important topic.

 

Comment edited by coolcatmillie on Friday, 16 February 2007 14:43:12

Posted by canvas on Friday, 16 February 2007 14:45:52

Yes, you're right - I do miss my father greatly. :)

http://webcameron.informe.com

 

Comment edited by canvas on Friday, 16 February 2007 14:49:21