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Fed up with the way that touring the country works in politics
10/05/2007
I’m already rather fed up with the way that touring the country works in politics. You charge around having to meet deadlines imposed by the media and the Parliamentary timetable. An hour here an hour there (frequently half hour, in fact) with snatched conversations, half learning things but not getting to the bottom of a problem and often failing to gain a proper understanding of what’s going on.
There’s too much of people telling you what they think you want to hear, and too often the boldest or loudest voices dominate, rather than the most considered and thoughtful.
So I’ve decided to spend some proper time out of Westminster. For the last couple of days I have been in Balsall Heath in Birmingham, living in the house of a British Asian family.
I’m staying with Abdullah who’s 37 and married to Shahida. They have three children: two girls and a boy, and I’ve also met many of the extended family who live in the area. Abdullah’s a great guy - born in Birmingham, he’s lived here all his life. Since leaving school at in 1985 he studied Business and Finance before he helped to run the family corner grocery shop. He’s steeped in marketing, trading and knows most of the local small business people in the neighbourhood. His main interests are TV, travelling, enjoying family life and good food. He's a Villa fan and enjoyed playing when he was younger.
Yesterday was pretty busy. After going to Abdullah’s house to meet the family, we had a walk round the neighbourhood and chatted to some of the local shopkeepers and small business owners – you can see some of that in the films we'll be posting to Webcameron in the next 24 hours.
Then we went to the local mosque, where I had a really fascinating (and in some respects extremely worrying) conversation with some of the elders. After spending some more time in the local shops (including trying my hand at serving customers – not a great success) we met up with some parents at the Balsall Heath Forum, an amazing community organisation led by the brilliant social entrepreneur Dick Atkinson, then on to dinner back at Abdullah’s house, before going out on patrol with Abdullah, who’s a community warden. We ended the day with a drink in the local pub.
You can find out more about
Dick Atkinson and the Balsall Heath Forum here, and read the speech I
made a while back which talked about their work here.
Some impressions of my first day.
Yes it’s a cliché but people in this community work incredibly hard. The shopkeepers I spoke to (and worked with) yesterday tend to work 13 hour days, often 7 days a week. And far from the ever-onward march of the British Asian corner shop, they’ve been facing very tough competition. Abdullah and his family actually sold their shop, which was a key feature of life in Balsall Heath, some years ago. They showed me with great pride the newspaper cuttings about their shop, and talked about how it was much more than just a shop – more of a community centre, really. Now supermarkets are getting more savvy at stocking ethnic food, life is getting even tougher for small local shops here.
Another cliché is the strength of the extended family, but it really is so powerfully true. Abdullah and family see more of their aunts, uncles and cousins in a week than I see of mine in a year. Mum lives at home, rather than – as is the case in so many ethnically British families – elsewhere and alone.
Whether sitting in the Karachi Café, with its cross-cultural menu of southern fried chicken, kebabs and baltis, or having dinner with the family and friends at Abdullah’s home, or in the Balsall Heath Forum itself, a lot of the conversation is around the twin issues of cohesion – put simply, how do we live together - and the current threat of terrorism and how we should tackle it.
Let’s do terrorism first.
It’s hard to over-emphasise the importance of language. I know it sounds like a side issue, but it isn’t. We are just not getting this right. Every time the BBC or a politician talks about “Islamist terrorists” they are doing immense harm (and yes I am sure I have done this too, despite trying hard to get this right.) Think of Northern Ireland – “IRA terrorist” was fine because it marked them out as part of a terrorist group, Catholic terrorists would have been a disaster. Yet that is the equivalent of what we are doing now..
When they hear and see this kind of language, Muslims simply think – “they mean us.” Of course it’s impossible every single time to say “terrorists who are following a perverted strain of the true religion of Islam” but if we’re going to use shorthand we have got to do better.
Together with the issue about language, the other recurrent theme is the way the media handle these issues. The leaks about the arrests surrounding the alleged plot to capture and behead a British soldier did a lot of damage in the community here. And the perceived lack of balance in reporting the Muslim community comes up again and again. And it was boys at the supermarket check-out talking to me about these things, not activists from the MCB.
But there’s another side to this. Even accepting the point about language and the need for the media to think and act responsibly, do these conversations show that there is a problem amongst the Muslim community of accepting what has happened with 7/7 and other plots? Put simply is there an issue of denial?
In some parts of the community, yes. In the mosque and elsewhere I got the familiar depressing questions about who was really responsible for 9/11 and even 7/7. Dig a bit deeper and it all comes out. “CIA plot…Jews told to leave the twin towers” - even when it comes to 7/7 “how do we know the suicide bomber videos are real and not fakes?”
Even if this is a view held by 5 or 10 per cent of British muslims - and I suspect it is at least that – this is a real problem which we have all got to get to grips with.
That said there is plenty of gritty realism too. There is a justifiable anger amongst British muslims of Pakistani origin that so many radicalising preachers come from abroad – Syria, Egypt and Jordan – and yet so little has been done to deal with them.
The effect of all this on cohesion is depressing. One young businessman told me that it had set back progress by at least a decade. Another said that he felt constantly under suspicion and much less a welcome and normal part of British life than before.
But after a group of us had discussed these difficult issues over dinner, it was really striking that many of them came up to me individually and pointed out that in fact they as a community don’t talk about these things enough – that usually when they get together, the conversation’s just about the normal everyday things, football and so on, and that actually it’s really important for muslims to talk about these issues more.
The two things that have struck me most? The first is the centrality of education in all this. By far the most depressing meeting I had yesterday was listening to the dedicated and hard-working school governors talk about what was going on in their local secondary school. That any school is only getting 15 per cent of 16 year olds through 5 good GCSE is deeply depressing and totally unacceptable. They blamed a culture in the school which accepted low aspirations, as if kids in poorer areas somehow couldn’t be expected to do well. That is a disgusting attitude, and we’ve got to drive it right out of our education system. If ever there was a case for zero tolerance this is it Wherever such low standards and bad attitudes persist, schools should be taken over or closed, period.
My final thought yesterday was that integration is a two way street. Yes we can ask minority ethnic communities to work at integrating with British society as a whole, but we have to recognise that it won’t happen unless there’s something attractive to integrate into. Time after time I heard people here talking about the uncivilised behaviour and values that they see all around them. As I’ve said before, we can’t just bully people into being more British, we’ve got to inspire them. And frankly, there are many aspects of our society today which are hardly inspiring – the drinking, the drug-taking, the rudeness and incivility, the lack of consideration for others, anti-social behaviour…we’ve got a serious fight on our hands to build a responsible society that is the kind of society people admire and want to be part of. I know we can do it because most people in this country, like the people I’ve met here, are decent, hard-working and committed to their communities. We’ve got to much more to make sure that those are the values that win out.
Posted by scrubsupwell 10/05/2007 16:16:57
Subject: Opening the Doors
I like this piece David - it says more about you than anything I have read. Thanks for taking part of my soul onboard as well - Thank-You
Posted by canvas 10/05/2007 16:27:01
Subject:
I wondered where you were...
:)
Posted by astrocat 10/05/2007 16:32:27
Subject:
I think this is a great idea to spend time with people to get a deeper insight into their lives. I hope you do it again and write about it so that we too can learn about the opinions of other people without any media bias.
Posted by shortbread 10/05/2007 16:59:52
Subject: Education
5 A-C grades a GCSE seems to be a very publicised figure, I agree that in this respect standards are being set far to low. School children believe that as long as they get those 5 good GCSEs, that’s enough and therefore they don't have to motivation to go any further.
I fact, I think a lot of the problems in schools come motivation. During my school life I attended both a poorly performing state school and an excellent private school, the main difference between them was not the teaching or buildings, it was the attitude of the students to their work and the respect they gained the teachers for that.
If the motivation and attitude of our children to their studies that we need to change.
Posted by Gordy 10/05/2007 17:36:40
Subject:
David, spending time living with an average Muslim family in an average Muslim community is all very well but you're doing them no favours by not giving it to them straight when it comes to Islamism.
Most Muslims are in denial. They don't really want to take sides between the British state and the Islamists. All other communities are clear where they stand - against the terrorists and their pernicious ideology - but too many Muslims adopt an attitude that is at best naive and at worst downright disingenuous. 9/11 denial is a symptom of a deeper malaise.
Just as white people have a special duty to confront the fascists of the BNP who claim to speak in our name so Muslims - every single one of them - have a particular responsibility to lead the fight against the Islamists. Continued pacifity or changing the subject is unnaceptable.
And, sorry, but avoiding the word "Islamism" is simply colluding with the fence sitters who don't want to face up to their responsibilities.
Posted by savethepublicsectortheprivateinvasion 10/05/2007 18:58:43
Subject:
its great to see David Cameron making such an effort... im just hoping its much more then a PR stunt and an opportunity to grab traditional labour voters in the heart of England.
Posted by canvas 10/05/2007 20:47:51
Subject: Question for David
"When they hear and see this kind of language, Muslims simply think – “they mean us.” Of course it’s impossible every single time to say “terrorists who are following a perverted strain of the true religion of Islam” but if we’re going to use shorthand we have got to do better."
I am just wondering if DC has any suggestions?
Posted by fleetpete 10/05/2007 20:54:28
Subject: Real Deal?
For years I've been saying that if a politician ever started being straight with people, and I mean really straight, they would take the country by storm. The media and the chattering classes will have collective heart failure, but the electorate would love it. I think we might, just might be seeing that come about. Trust your instincts David.
Posted by muratoa 10/05/2007 20:58:39
Subject:
interesting viewpoint on a long term potentially serious issue...problem is when religious schools of all faiths get better exam results than secular ones, how do we convince parents that it is in their interest to send their children to schools that promote children's integration into a British outlook while encouraging local community spirit rather than sponsoring a ghetto way of life. How can this be addressed within government while ensuring education standards are equal?
Posted by Podnosh 10/05/2007 21:30:40
Subject:
Great choice of neighbourhood - so much to learn in balsall heath, not just about city life but about how communal effort can boost life opportunities.
Posted by sundial 10/05/2007 21:38:44
Subject:
Did you have a balti during your stay, then?
I don't doubt your sincerity but as Blair said today, when you're in opposition you can take on board considerations all sides. But when you are in power, you are expected to provide the answer.
Good luck with that. Seriously.
a balsall heathan
Posted by srfielding 10/05/2007 22:05:31
Subject:
David, please keep up the good work. Not only will you answer many of your critics but you'll also help clean up politics.
Posted by Tahira 11/05/2007 00:02:46
Subject: Great initiative!
I can't express how important it is that a politician is prepared to make this effort to actually talk with ordinary Muslims - rather than talking about us or at us as usual. This diary entry has really changed my perception of you - for the better!
Posted by Roverdc 11/05/2007 08:36:58
Subject: Muslim acceptance
Unless I was taught wrongly I believe Islam demands modest dress. The insistance by some of wearing full black garb is not modest, it is an ostentacious show of excessive piety and not at all in keeping with their own teachings. As for a veil it is extremist as proved by the minutely small number of Muslims doing so and if you dress in the uniform of a fanatic follower of any group it is not unreasonable or unacceptable for others to treat you as such.
Muslims should start by understanding that to many they are,like it or not an unwelcome faith with many unacceptable views if some interpretations of the teachings are followed. The girl in the bank wears a pretty blue headscarf and looks charming. Is she some sort of religious failure? I don't know but her general manner I believe not. Think about this if you don't want to become a persecuted sect.
Posted by terjoha 11/05/2007 11:46:11
Subject:
The overwhelming majority of British Muslims are just like the overwhelming majority of British Christians or Jew: not particularly religious. They are concerned about what they can earn, how to feed their family, how their businesses are doing, where they will go on holiday this year and whether Ronaldo dives to win penalties. The problem is that whereas religious Jews and Christians are able to separate those parts of their religions that call for violent retribution those that talk about love, peace and fellowship; most religious Muslims seem unable to do so. We have successfully imported a series of primitive preachers who don't speak English and have no experience of living in a liberal democracy and whose uncivilized message has corrupted out Muslim youth.
Marginalising Muslims simply bolsters belligerence. I am glad you have gone to Balsall Heath. I pray it isn't just a stunt.
Posted by Conand 11/05/2007 12:07:41
Subject: Light at the end of the tunnel.
I'm glad DC has done this. I'm a WASP who has stayed with Muslim friends. It might sound racist towards white british people but I am very struck by the ways in which their family and community life seem better than ours. On 9/11 and after I was appalled at how we seemed to be heading into the abyss. If we can keep talking and interacting I'm still utterly convinced that British Muslims can contribute enormously to the good of our national life. Labour ministers 'talking tough' and ordering moderate muslims to sort everything out didn't and doesn't seem very constructive.
Posted by open2persuasion 11/05/2007 15:03:49
Subject: Engaging and thought provoking...
If what I have just read comes directly David's head, heart and keyboard and not via a posse of spinmasters then I pronounce myself engaged and enthused by it.
I found this an intelligent and thought provoking article that resulted an excellent idea that I would like to see extended into other aspects of post Blair British Society.
Why indeed would someone wish to become more British if the behaviour and attitudes they see around them is utterly repugnant?
Posted by AndrewFarnden 11/05/2007 18:27:20
Subject: more of the same!
This was an great idea, its so important to close this gap of understanding. I am sure you felt this was a real investment.
I felt that when you were in Darfur you could of found a far more inspireing place to stay than the posh hotel they took you to. Maybe thats one for the future.
Posted by ArthurWaik 12/05/2007 19:26:10
Subject:
I take exception to this:
"Yes we can ask minority ethnic communities to work at integrating with British society as a whole, but we have to recognise that it won’t happen unless there’s something attractive to integrate into. "
So it's our fault is it? I, too, am not very happy with the behaviour of some members of British society but this does not mean I do not accept that this is my country warts and all. If I could not accept it I would go and live somewhere else. British Asians who do not like how Britain is also have this option. They, or their forebears, have made the journey here from Asia and could make the journey back just as easily.
To suggest that the rest of us are responsible for these individuals refusing to integrate is just the usual woolly minded Politically Correct nonsense peddled by the left in this country up there with the we should all feel guilty about the Empire etc.
Very dissappointing, but sadly not surprising, from David Cameron.
Posted by canvas 13/05/2007 00:31:55
Subject:
Posted by canvas 10/05/2007 20:47:51
Subject: Question for David
"When they hear and see this kind of language, Muslims simply think – “they mean us.” Of course it’s impossible every single time to say “terrorists who are following a perverted strain of the true religion of Islam” but if we’re going to use shorthand we have got to do better."
I am just wondering if DC has any suggestions?
I DID NOT POST THIS COMMENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Webcameron? WTF?
Posted by canvas 13/05/2007 00:35:33
Subject: ooops!
I was quoting! Yes,I did. Sorry. Late night. :( LoL
Posted by StevenL 13/05/2007 12:14:15
Subject: Intergration
The thing that gets me, is that in a free country, where we have freedom of speech, freedom of association and freedom of expression, we can't tell people what to say and who to hang around with.
There are lots of white people that don't want to associate with Muslims and lots of Muslims that don't want to associate with white folk. You can't make them either.
White folk are always going to look at Islamic and Asian culture and make their own minds up about it just as British Muslims will look at mainstream European liberal culture and make up their minds. They are all free to do so.
People will always stereotype too, it's just a natural function of the human brain. Personally, as a cricket lover I find I have something in common with most Pakistanis and usually get on with them. I tend to associate them with my love of cricket more than anything else. Lots of white folk I know can't stand them. I've lived in areas with large Pakistani communities and even pre-9/11 there was a sizable chunk of them that refused to speak to white people.
Posted by Levi 13/05/2007 14:51:07
Subject:
On integration:
People don't want to integrate. People like familiarity. If you moved to the USA, and had a choice of 2 (identical) houses on the same street, only 1 of them would mean you had a British neighbor... which one would you chose?
A more extreme test of the same theory is if you move to Bradford would you rather live in Manningham (exclusively populated by Asains) or Wibsey (where there's a White majority)? I suspect it would depend on your race more than house prices etc. You want to live where you fit in; where you can feel like you belong to the community.
All this has a negative effect as the Asian communities begin to leave the English language behind in favor of their "native" tongue, and turn the area into what might as-well be a foreign country, only with the benefits of being a British Citizen (or an illegal immigrant... the lines blurry).
Now, I have no problem with this in itself (I know I must sound racist, but I'm really not). Let the Asian community have the whole of Bradford as their own; I couldn't care less. The problem comes when the Asian community has to let in White "outsiders" and indeed vice versa. Now of-course, on an individual basis this is fine. We're all adults. We can all share and play nice... but over time, a white guy does this and a black guy does that and the tensions just grow and grow. The communities begin to band together again, tighter; "were they belong", where they feel safe... and it's one huge vicious circle.
I use Bradford as an example because it's what I'm familiar with, and the riots a few years back emphasize the point nicely, but I'm sure the same could be said for many of the UKs cities.
It isn't that it's "our" fault minorities don't want to integrate, it's just human nature. Why would you live with people of other races, religions, cultures, languages etc when you could live with people of your own "kind". It's fine as a holiday, but most people wouldn't want to take the plunge and do it for the rest of their life. Would you like to live in Manninham Mr. Cameron? Adopt a different dress code, language, diet, social etiquette? You think they'd welcome you with open arms as an active member of the community? "They" don't want to integrate for the same reasons you wouldn't.
Multiculturalism doesn't exist outside of London... money is a universal language, and where you find money you'll find people from any background willing to integrate if it means they can get a piece of it.
Sorry DC, I gave you the benefit of the doubt with all the "Green" stuff, but you're taking PC to a new level. "Islamic terrorists", "Christian terrorists". Spade is a spade is spade. Do you think calling Islamic terrorists a different name will really improve relations? What does it matter when they're on the front page and the TV every day; the largely innocent, upstanding Muslim community will still feel the heat.
Posted by ArthurWaik 13/05/2007 21:53:46
Subject:
Levi,
I can see some sense in what you're saying. There was a comment DC made in one of the Birmingham videos when he was talking about giving housing association tenants the right to buy thus creating a mixed community of tenants and owner occupiers. He said "...because mixed communities are better...".
Again, this worries me. This is a typically utopian left idea that, for the reasons you've stated, does not work in reality. People from different income levels do not want to be plonked next to each other. In fact I would contend that strong communities are built when people feel they have something in common, social engineering experiments such as mixed income communities may well have the opposite effect !
So again DC is sounding like one of the la-la land middle class left PC brigade just when the country's looking for something different after 10 years of all of that.
Posted by chewie 15/05/2007 15:56:22
Subject:
fair play for actually going to see through your own eyes how some people live in the UK, without the media scrum and the staged managed bollocks we've have in the last decade.
Posted by RSJ 15/05/2007 18:59:56
Subject:
I've a theory on antisocial behaviour.
Mostly I blame the expansion of the government; all the CCTV, proposed ID cards, the ASBO scheme, and the legislative hyperactivity cause me to feel that this is a government that wants to continually look over my shoulder. I feel like showing two fingers to it just because I'm very aware that it's looking.
Posted by drakesdrum 15/05/2007 19:04:32
Subject: Isalmist terrorism and Michael Gove
Dear Mr Cameron
this is the first time I have visited your blog, and it is very good and polished, and I congratulate you. You deserve to be the Prime Minister, even if solely on account of how hard you are trying to undo Blair's damage to our Institutions, through your promotion of how ordinary people if left to themselves, could help themselves and each other. If only you would say that you would sack seven eighths of our bureaucrats (mostly "new" "labour" ones) as a starting measure, and shred the records of the departments of them and all the rest, and cut taxation accordingly. Then you would be a conservative.
However, I was interested in your account of your stay with Abdullah and his fmaily. I know lots of people like that and they would all agree with him and you. The fact remains however that the Q'uran does say certain things about the Ummah and the Dhimmi, and what will happen. The "terrorists" whom Gove refers to, do regard "Islam" as a jurisdiction (and not a religon, so your Catholic jibe falls down here) in the same way that you and I regard, say, the UK, or the USA as a jurisdiction.
This, there is no point in not taking them and "where they are coming from" as seriously as I am sure that you would have to, if you as PM were responsible for any consequences of pretending that they "the terrorists" are merely behaving like the fringe hotheads of a rather youngish religion.
I think that Gove's remarks merely reflect what most people are thinking. You have been in PR yourself; you and I therefore both know the hysterical reliance placed by operators in that industry since the mid-1980s on "research"...finding out what Mondeo Man thinks today...etc, and spinning that to the client after carefully editing it to comply with what the communications objectives have been already agreed to be! You like me, therefore, can recognize unwelcome truths, and as a politician you are forced to behave in public as though you believe they don't matter.
Most people would agree with Gove because "All-that-Jazzera" and the BBC happily provide video footage of "Islamist Terrorists" being quite frank about what they want to do to Western liberal society.
I am quite sure that Abdullah and his family, and the hundreds of thousands of others just like him and them, would never want to or think of doing any such thing, but they are not in charge of the messianic objectives of what calls itself their "religion".
Posted by CharlesG 16/05/2007 12:56:25
Subject:
David,
First of all it is highly inappropriate to compare the IRA and Islamist terrorists according to their nomenclature. Of course IRA terrorists were never referred to as Catholic terrorists - their Catholicism was merely a point of difference between them and their adversaries. As their name implies they were Irish Republicans. Their aims were associated with the issue of sovereignty of Northern Ireland - not spreading Catholic doctrine. Therefore 'Catholic terrorists' would, as you say, be an inappropriate term.
This is not the case with Islamist terrorists. Their aims are specifically to further a global Islamic agenda. Who are we to say what is genuine Islam or what is a perversion of Islam? If you read certain passages of the Islamic scriptures you will find that the actions and intent of Islamic terrorists did not just come from nowhere - it is inspired by the Koran and Hadith. Read about some of the deeds of the Prophet Mohamed himself (and if you do please don't babble about it being a ‘religion of peace’ like Bush and Blair did after 9/11). The Islamist terrorists and their supporters are absolutely convinced that theirs is the true expression of Islam. They hate all western culture and all other religions and are intent on one religion on earth only. And they are actually following their scriptures. So they are ‘Islamist’ terrorists.
Don't expect to be informed about Islam by chatting with people like Abdullah. The more you learn about Islam, the more you will see that the integration of devout Muslims will never be possible, regardless of whether some of us (indigenous British) are prone to anti-social behaviour or whether we, horror of horrors - drink too much. And we like pork. Islamists hate us all regardless of our good or bad points as individuals and as a society and ‘moderate’ Muslims feel the same only more ‘moderately’.
Another thing - I believe it is nearer to half of all British Muslims that think that 9/11 was a Zionist conspiracy, not 5 or 10 percent. You will also find many lefties hold to this view, even Michael Meacher is a 9/11 sceptic. (If you want a statistic you can trust I'm sure you can commission another survey. Sounds like you could be in for a surprise).
To hell with political correctness, multiculturalism and the enemies of the free and open society.
Posted by Conand 18/05/2007 17:44:39
Subject: Donal Blaney on 18doughtystreet
I just watched this video:
http://www.18doughtystreet.com/on_demand/441
Within which Donal Blaney states (in a really patronizing way) that DC doesn't understand the difference between Islam and Islamism.
Donal, Cameron does understand the difference he's just afraid of non-muslim politicians and commentators being misinterpreted.
To borrow Donal's introductory sentence in this vid: sometimes I warm to web commentators like you and then you say something daft.
Posted by Conand 18/05/2007 17:58:09
Subject: Donal Blaney on 18doughtystreet
I just watched this video:
http://www.18doughtystreet.com/on_demand/441
Within which Donal Blaney states (in a really patronizing way) that DC doesn't understand the difference between Islam and Islamism.
Donal, Cameron does understand the difference he's just afraid of non-muslim politicians and commentators being misinterpreted.
To borrow Donal's introductory sentence in this vid: sometimes I warm to web commentators like you and then you say something daft.
Posted by Conand 18/05/2007 17:59:19
Subject: Whoops
whoops i posted that twice.
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